New member from Italy with a lot of questions :-)

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gianluca
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New member from Italy with a lot of questions :-)

#1 Mensaje por gianluca » Vie 4-Jun-2021 11:37

Good morning,
my name is Gianluca and I am a new member from Italy. I apologize for writing in English, however I cannot write in Spanish at all (I never studied Spanish). I can understand a bit of it when I read it and maybe this will be a chance for me to start learning!

I signed up to this Forum because I am very interested in starting a collection of Classic Spanish stamps and I am sure I can find a lot of good information and advices here.

So, can I start with a few questions?

I have two catalogues: Edifil and Filabo. Do you think they are both good sources? Is one better than the other?
I know that the difference between catalogue values and real world values change from country to country. How are catalogue values of classic Spanish stamps compared to retail values?
Could you also direct me to web sources in English about Spanish stamps?

My focus, for the moment, will be classic Spain. For sure I will begin at 1850 (Isabel’s reign: I really love those fancy classic imperforated stamps ☺) but I am unsure where I should put a cut off. 1900? Republic? What are your thoughts?
What do you think are the most interesting periods, at least for a beginner like me?

I am also looking for a good hingeless album. I found several options on the web but I cannot really figure out which one is the best in terms of quality/cost, coverage of stamps, etc. Any experience and advice about albums?

Ok, I think there are enough questions for now… I will really appreciate any answer or comment to start learning about Spanish stamps.

Thank you very much!

Best,
Gianluca

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Carlos Juan
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Re: New member from Italy with a lot of questions :-)

#2 Mensaje por Carlos Juan » Sab 5-Jun-2021 13:52

Hola Gianluca

De ingles ni idea, vamos con el traductor de google:

No es que yo sea especialista ni mucho menos, pero te dire lo que se a la espera de opiniones realmente valiosas:
Tengo dos catálogos: Edifil y Filabo. ¿Crees que ambos son buenas fuentes? ¿Es uno mejor que el otro?
Sí pero practicamente todo el mundo en España usa el edifil. Hay uno normal y otro especializado, o sea con muchos mas detalles. Los sellos clasicos españoles son bastante caros salvo algunos valores y hay varias falsificaciones. Si vas a coleccionar un poco a fondo creo que necesitaras el especializado.
Sé que la diferencia entre los valores del catálogo y los valores del mundo real cambia de un país a otro. ¿Cómo se comparan los valores de catálogo de los sellos españoles clásicos con los valores de venta al público?
Los catalogos traen precios muy superiores a los normales. Mirar en el ivert y tellier te puede servir para comparar precios. Hay que tener en cuenta tambien que el estado de los sellos (viveza del color, margenes, etc,) puede hacer subir o bajar mucho el valor de los sellos.

En este enlace (usando el traductor de google) puedes ver un debate donde intervinieron varios especialistas y se trato el tema:
http://www.filaposta.com/foro/viewtopic.php?t=109#p573

Una idea es mirar los precios de las subastas:

Ahi puedes ver en cuanto se venden realmente los sellos en subastas publicas.

Yo hice un estudio comparativo en 2007 que te puede servir para hacerte una idea y puedes usar la misma tecnica con datos actuales para algun sello que te interese:

http://www.filaposta.com/foro/viewtopic ... sta#p12679
¿Podría también indicarme fuentes web en inglés sobre sellos en español?
Mas bien no. Te dejo el directorio de enlaces del foro:

http://www.filaposta.com/enlaces2/index2.html

y el subforo en ingles:

http://www.filaposta.com/foro/viewforum.php?f=15

Mi foco, de momento, será la España clásica. Seguro que empezaré en 1850 (el reinado de Isabel: me encantan esos elegantes sellos clásicos sin perforar ☺), pero no estoy seguro de dónde debería poner un corte. ¿1900? ¿República? ¿Cuáles son tus pensamientos?
No me atrevo a contestar. Creo que a partir de 1920 o asi se empezaron a hacer algunas series que era para vender a los coleccionistas mas que para circular. Lo anterior me parece mas autentico, pero esto es muy personal y ademas no entiendo lo suficiente. El ivert considera clasicos hasta 1940, puede ser una pauta sensata.

¿Cuáles crees que son los períodos más interesantes, al menos para un principiante como yo?
De 1977 en adelante te puedes olvidar. Lo más interesante imagino es lo mas antiguo 1850 1900 y las emisiones en momentos de conflicto (emisiones carlistas, guerra civil, emisiones locales patrioticas).
También busco un buen álbum sin bisagras. Encontré varias opciones en la web, pero realmente no puedo descifrar cuál es la mejor en términos de calidad / costo, cobertura de sellos, etc. ¿Alguna experiencia y consejo sobre álbumes?
Lo normal es que los albumes a la venta de las empresas mas al uso, se ajusten como un guante al edifil, al menos los tipos basicos, no las variedades, etc.

Si quieres hacertelas tu, tienes el apartado de hojas de album del foro

http://www.filaposta.com/album/
Ok, creo que hay suficientes preguntas por ahora… Realmente agradeceré cualquier respuesta o comentario para comenzar a aprender sobre los sellos en español.
Ya tienes para un buen rato y a disfrutar.....
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gianluca
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Registrado: Vie 4-Jun-2021 11:36

Re: New member from Italy with a lot of questions :-)

#3 Mensaje por gianluca » Dom 6-Jun-2021 19:21

Hola Carlos,
muchas gracias por toda esta valiosa información! (no soy yo, es el traductor automático :D )

gracias por las respuestas y por los enlaces, muy útil

Happy stamping!

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Carlos Juan
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Re: New member from Italy with a lot of questions :-)

#4 Mensaje por Carlos Juan » Dom 6-Jun-2021 23:56

Gracias a ti por tu atenta respuesta.

Siempre puedes escribir en italiano, es mucho mas bonito que el ingles y lo que no entendamos, pues con el traductor automatico.

Un placer y ya nos contaras.
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Hades
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Re: New member from Italy with a lot of questions :-)

#5 Mensaje por Hades » Lun 7-Jun-2021 08:52

Ciao, Gianluca,
gianluca escribió: Vie 4-Jun-2021 11:37I have two catalogues: Edifil and Filabo. Do you think they are both good sources? Is one better than the other?
Forget Filabo and stay with Edifil. Also when talking about classic stamps you should get the specialized version (volume 1850-1900), it's quite expensive (85€) but provides tons of information that you can't get otherwise.
gianluca escribió: Vie 4-Jun-2021 11:37I know that the difference between catalogue values and real world values change from country to country. How are catalogue values of classic Spanish stamps compared to retail values?
Yes, that's quite common. The differences between auction, retail and catalog values are significant, and vary depending on the kind of stamps you are looking for. It's different regarding de luxe, brand new stamps or used lots to build a cancellation collection. For best prices you should follow the auction houses, where you could get nice individual stamps starting at 25-30% of catalog prices (expect a 50% or more for the best ones). Retail (shop) prices are often much higher.
gianluca escribió: Vie 4-Jun-2021 11:37Could you also direct me to web sources in English about Spanish stamps?
Most active auction houses:
https://www.iberphiltienda.com/
https://www.soleryllach.com/es
https://www.filateliallach.com/fllach4/inicio

gianluca escribió: Vie 4-Jun-2021 11:37My focus, for the moment, will be classic Spain. For sure I will begin at 1850 (Isabel’s reign: I really love those fancy classic imperforated stamps ☺) but I am unsure where I should put a cut off. 1900? Republic? What are your thoughts?
Spanish philatelists usually split their collections into the following political periods:
- Classic (1850 Isabel to 1889 or 1905 Alfonso XIII, included or excluded)
- 1st Centenary from Alfonso XIII (1889 or 1905) to 1931
- II Republic from 1931 to 1939
- Estado español from 1936 to 1949
- II Centenary from 1950 onwards

Moreover, you will find some specialties such as Canarias (issues during the civil war), Barcelona (surcharges over normal rates), Sobrecargas patrióticas y republicanas (during the civil war) and so on.

As for classic, Isabel II has several sub-periods according to different criteria. For example, you could focus on the imperforate (1850-1865) or perforated (1865-1868) periods. In addition to, you could also split the first one depending on the postal rates (1850-54 for 6 cuartos, 1855-65 for 4 cuartos). Both cost and possibilities of exploring cancellations, forgeries, blocks, etc. are very different (much better the 4 cuartos period).

Classic era includes also the turbulent periods. The Carlist issues (1873), the Gobierno provisional (1870) and II Republica (1873-74).

Please note that Alfonso XII (1875-1889) is also an interesting period with a few issues with rich cancellations.

As for recommendations, it depends on what you have in mind. You can intend a classic collection (one stamp of each value) or a specialized (all you can get about an issue). It will probably be (almost) impossible to build a "linear" classic collection since they are overlaps and some values are extremely difficult to get. You should see the 1850-1900 period as a set of closed-closable collections and I would recommend you a calm, deep and patient observation of what you can easily find on the market before starting to buy. Decide what you want to build and then go for it :wink:
gianluca escribió: Vie 4-Jun-2021 11:37What do you think are the most interesting periods, at least for a beginner like me?
I would recommend you a non-expensive approach to the spanish classic stamps based on focusing on a single stamp. Take one of the less expensive 4 cuartos (Edifil 52 or 58, for example, better the first one). Then try to learn the issue, cancellations (it's a very rich stamp), forgeries, colours, blocks, used on letter. Read and study what is already known about it... and start buying. From single, deluxe stamps to mass lots where you can search missing cancellations, towns, dates or numbers. There is a rich bilbliography that can assist you in this.
gianluca escribió: Vie 4-Jun-2021 11:37I am also looking for a good hingeless album. I found several options on the web but I cannot really figure out which one is the best in terms of quality/cost, coverage of stamps, etc. Any experience and advice about albums?
When talking about standard one-by-one-stamp albums Edifil and Leuchtturm are the most popular. But keep in mind that it depends on what and how are you focusing the collection. If you follow my last recommendation you won't find album at all and you will have to build your own album sheets. Which is a further pleasant activity :wink:.

And... welcome to this exciting world :wink:

gianluca
Mensajes: 6
Registrado: Vie 4-Jun-2021 11:36

Re: New member from Italy with a lot of questions :-)

#6 Mensaje por gianluca » Lun 7-Jun-2021 14:00

Hola Hades,
thank you very much for your rich, detailed, and very useful reply to all my queries. A couple of your responses and suggestions have already opened my mind on this interesting field of stamp collecting. Also, it will be a good chance for me to learn a bit more about the Spanish history, since I realized that I don't know very much about the quick changes that happened during the 1850-1930 period. As usual, stamp collecting brings together history, culture, and geography of a country (even anthropology and sociology sometimes), which is one of the best things of this hobby.

Best,
Gianluca

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